Anonymous said...
Hans 6:46
I agree with you completely. But it is often the innocent that get hurt by the "stupid" as you put it. My Grandfather always used to say "watch out for the other guy". Right now there is not even a complete lane of your own for a driver to stay in. The current corners do not even meet the sight lines for the speed of 30 km an hour. This is the only road in BC that two branches of the government claim administration of. Parks does not build the road to their Guidelines and when you ask them a question about the road they refer to MOTI. When you want MOTI to build it to their minimum standard they say they can not as Parks will not allow it. This political loop has to end and it needs to be build properly. This idiot could have run someone else off the road. And yes there will probably be more to come but there are reasons roads have minimum requirements. I believe that is to give the rest of us a fighting chance. There should be one complete lane going in each direction to give drivers a chance.
Bushes
September 10, 2014 at 9:08 AM
Hans 6:46
I agree with you completely. But it is often the innocent that get hurt by the "stupid" as you put it. My Grandfather always used to say "watch out for the other guy". Right now there is not even a complete lane of your own for a driver to stay in. The current corners do not even meet the sight lines for the speed of 30 km an hour. This is the only road in BC that two branches of the government claim administration of. Parks does not build the road to their Guidelines and when you ask them a question about the road they refer to MOTI. When you want MOTI to build it to their minimum standard they say they can not as Parks will not allow it. This political loop has to end and it needs to be build properly. This idiot could have run someone else off the road. And yes there will probably be more to come but there are reasons roads have minimum requirements. I believe that is to give the rest of us a fighting chance. There should be one complete lane going in each direction to give drivers a chance.
Bushes
September 10, 2014 at 9:08 AM
Response by Coldstreamer
Dear Bushes.
My heart really bleeds for you!
However, when I first arrived in these parts in 1976 I had a lady employee whose family owned a piece of property at Cosens Bay. They had a key for the gate from the Ranch and had to go through a locked gate to access their property. There was really no road but a rugged trail which probably did not allow 30 km speed but they were apparently satisfied as these properties were used as wilderness summer retreats (hence the R6 zoning).
Now you have a significantly improved road to the detriment of the park’s environment and you want to have more and more and more! Where will you buy your next wilderness summer retreat?
My heart really bleeds for you!
However, when I first arrived in these parts in 1976 I had a lady employee whose family owned a piece of property at Cosens Bay. They had a key for the gate from the Ranch and had to go through a locked gate to access their property. There was really no road but a rugged trail which probably did not allow 30 km speed but they were apparently satisfied as these properties were used as wilderness summer retreats (hence the R6 zoning).
Now you have a significantly improved road to the detriment of the park’s environment and you want to have more and more and more! Where will you buy your next wilderness summer retreat?
***************************************************************************
8 comments:
Hide in the bushes,
Have another look at the videos I shot. The only time I stopped was out of courtesy since there were two cars going in the opposite direction, closely following each other.
Through one of your "blind corners" I met the "Honey Wagon" (Septic tanker truck), neither one of us stopped.
But you tell me about head-on collisions, I would love to see the collision report on that one.
As I keep repeating everyone who bought and/or built out on Cosens Bay Road, south of the Park, knew what that road is/was like.
BTW what is really interesting on this saga is how the reasoning keeps changing.
So far we heard/read about the high taxes and no services - all known prior to building or purchasing- , next about the environmental impact of gray water and seeping sewage - there is a Parks study on that, complete with recommendations -, this is followed by the safety issue. Interestingly the traffic count keeps changing as well. Erik Lachmuth mentioned two hundred cars when I spoke with him at the "Info event".
Facetiously I would suggest that MoTI fixes up "your portion" of the road - starting at the turn around where the "End of ....." sign is - that glorified creek bed really needs some fixing.
Hans-Joerg Mueller
Coldstream
I'm off on my next little project; as I have mentioned pictures and videos are worth a lot more than words.
HJ : Our HERO!
We need a photo drive of all old images that show the road as it was before the entitled got their paws all over our park.
We need a Provincial Campaign: #It'sYourParkToo
And what is for sale at the South End of Cosens Bay Road?
http://www.okanaganhomes.com/development-kalamalka.html
Call for additional information
If you're interested in pictures start with this and keep clicking the right arrow
https://www.flickr.com/photos/realestatehub/4360759868/in/photostream/
I have wondered for some time where all the docks popped up from - we go for twice daily hikes in Kal Park and notice all kinds of activity on the East Shore of Cosens Bay - I'm still wondering if they're actually sanctioned.
But it's all about safety, isn't it??? ;)
Yes Coldstreamer the mismanagement of the road by the DOC created many false impressions for the public, Parks, and the property owners. Fortunately the BC Supreme Court and Appeals Court set the record straight. Under Oath DOC staffer testified to documents not existing, Later with a subpoena the documents in question were found in a locked filing cabinet. Yes that means the DOC lied to the courts under oath. If the DOC is willing to lie under oath, what else are they willing to do. Those documents showed that DOC spent tax payers money on the road and that it was listed as a road that the DOC maintained. The DOC offered up other documents in exchange for immunity from prosecution. That combined with the Homesteaders act and many homesteads out in Cosens Bay provided the judge with evidence that the road existed since the 1900's. The judge set the record straight but he had no idea the DOC would continue to break the law by allowing Parks to put a gate back on the road. The judge was called to Vernon and again ordered the gate to be removed. Then the DOC passed an illegal bylaw stating they would not maintain Cosens Bay Road. Although policies regarding maintenance of roads are within the DOC right to pass they must be broad in scope and not target a specific road. The DOC can not have a Bylaw saying we will not pick up garbage on postil street.
So I feel sorry for the lady that worked for you and others that were lied to by the DOC.
Hans mentions by hook or by crook. My experience is the crooks are usually the ones that need immunity. The property owners accepted the courts giving you immunity. I am sure they would reconsider if they knew the DOC would continue to block their legal rights.
This whole situation is a result of the DOC willingness to lie to the courts. I guess if you are willing to do that it should be no surprise that you can lie to the public.
Maybe Hans should research who was mayor of DOC when the DOC lied to the courts.
Dear "Hiding in the bushes"
Let me contrast you comments with someone's who actually lived in the Cosens Bay community.
Quote
"In my opinion there is no justification for this to be a public road in the first place. The properties in the Cosens Bay cabin colony were all water access only (I owned one and was very happy that it was so) We were priveledged to have use of the road for emergencies and also to haul building materials when needed on the private road, first by the Coldstream Ranch and later by the BC Provincial Parks branch. The change to a public road was obtained by deception and did not reflect the wishes of all of the cabin owners. I believe that any change to the road will be extremely detrimental to the Park. There is no reason why the Parks Department cannot make improvements to the road under it's own mandate in order to address the safety concerns of the cabin owners beyond the grass lands."
Isn't that an interesting opinion from someone who actually lived there, quite possibly some time back before the very busy Klim & Co usurped all manner of rights. Very interesting indeed!
As regards very old records
a) it is very doubtful that elected officials are aware of every little detail that goes back decades.
b) if you don't know about it you can't possibly lie about it, can you?
c) all the rest about the "you scratch my back and I'll scratch yours" arrangements I've already mentioned.
Apparently you haven't lived in a rural setting - other than Cosens Bay - or you would be well acquainted with "how things work".
I resided for eighteen years in a rural township in Ontario, with a neighbour who displayed a similar attitude to Klim's.
And one day his carefully constructed house of cards collapsed thanks to yours truly who didn't need a lawyer, just enough research.
BTW that was long before the Internet. ;) :)
No, I didn't waste my time writing "letters to the editor" or submissions to the township council nor the county. I saved that effort for the provincial departments and authorities who were in charge.
Hans-Joerg Mueller
Coldstream
HI Hans:
Cosens Bay road through the park is the only public road in all of BC that does not have a designated Right of way. It also does not meet the MINIMUM Standard for a public road of it's traffic usage.
In all you smoke and mirrors not once have you addressed why the property owners in Cosens Bay or the Public that use the road do not have a legal right to have both of those. It Does not matter if Alice Klim is an Id__t or if there once was an owner that liked having their rights trampled on. It does not matter if the kid who drove off the cliff is incompetent or driving without a license. The road should have a Right of Way like all other public roads in BC and It should meet MINIMUM STANDARDS.
Dear "Hiding in the bushes",
As a matter of fact I did address that.
I asked if Coldstream Ranch Limited, from whom BC Parks acquired the Park property, ever ceded a Right of Way etc. etc.
I'm under the impression that you only read what fits your world view and studiously ignore inconvenient questions.
But that's not a problem, I got a general reminder how things seem to work at the MoTI "Info event" where I could not get an answer, from no less than four MoTI representatives, why they need a 30 meter RoW,
Many years ago DOC had a public meeting regarding the expansion of a certain private facility.
There were many people who added their two cents - actually in some cases it sounded more like a nickel or even a dime - to the topic.
My comment at the lectern was very short and to the point, it went like this: "Any project has to pass one basic test ... the smell test. And this project stinks"
The same goes for this proposal.
BTW next day I got a call from someone that my comment was broadcast on CHBC and for months after I got a lot of friendly smiles around Vernon and environs.
I also appreciate irony, the more extreme, the better e.g you talking about smoke and mirrors. Highly ironic coming from someone who needs to hide in the bushes i.e. hasn't got the courage to bare his identity. :D :D :D
Hans-Joerg Mueller
Coldstream
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